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 Post subject: Re: 100 Greatest Rock Bass Guitarists
PostPosted: Fri May 25, 2012 10:02 pm 
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StuBass wrote:
StuBass wrote:
City Of Nashville to honor Babbitt!

The City of Nashville, Tennessee is honoring Bob Babbitt with a Star on the Music City Walk Of Fame. The ceremony is scheduled for June 5th and is open to the public. Babbitt is being inducted along with Steve Winwood. Pray for Babbitt being there to enjoy the honor.


Just sent Babbitt an e-mail informing him of his position on the list and wishing him the best on behalf of everyone. I remember how honored he was when he first got even mentioned on the list...but that's Babbitt. He's just coming to terms I believe to some extent as to just how respected and influential he is within the bass world.


:smile:


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 Post subject: Re: 100 Greatest Rock Bass Guitarists
PostPosted: Sat May 26, 2012 3:31 pm 
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Ariel wrote:

Ssoyd where do you think Bogert should reasonably end up? I'm thinking he's a top 20 lock, at minimum very high 21-25.



I'd put him between 15-20. No higher because of his short career (6 years) as a major artist although he did do studio work after. What about a spot for Gary Thain in the top 50?


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 Post subject: Re: 100 Greatest Rock Bass Guitarists
PostPosted: Sat May 26, 2012 8:34 pm 
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Yeah I support Thain in the top 50.

How high do you gents reckon Odum should be?


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 Post subject: Re: 100 Greatest Rock Bass Guitarists
PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2012 12:22 am 
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Who should get in 31-40?

My picks (of people already on the list): The Contenders
Bernard Odum
Carol Kaye
Mark King
Mike Watt
Phil Chen
Verdine White
Willie Weeks
John Wetton
Mike Rutherford
Greg Lake
George Porter Jr.
Ronnie Baker

Anyone I'm missing? Hmm


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 Post subject: Re: 100 Greatest Rock Bass Guitarists
PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2012 12:24 am 
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Odum is likely top 40 I think. As far as Thain goes, he'll get a respectable spot when we add him, but so far my plan has been to start adding people to the list after we're done ordering the current folks. Disagree?


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 Post subject: Re: 100 Greatest Rock Bass Guitarists
PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2012 5:51 am 
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Ariel wrote:
Odum is likely top 40 I think. As far as Thain goes, he'll get a respectable spot when we add him, but so far my plan has been to start adding people to the list after we're done ordering the current folks. Disagree?


Sounds reasonable but will we be discussing who should be dropped from the list to make room for more deserving players?


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 Post subject: Re: 100 Greatest Rock Bass Guitarists
PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2012 10:24 am 
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Ariel wrote:
Who should get in 31-40?

My picks (of people already on the list): The Contenders
Bernard Odum
Carol Kaye
Mark King
Mike Watt
Phil Chen
Verdine White
Willie Weeks
John Wetton
Mike Rutherford
Greg Lake
George Porter Jr.
Ronnie Baker

Anyone I'm missing? Hmm


Some solid names in this grouping. On those I'm real familiar with...

Odum: Fits nicely in with these.

Carol Kaye: As much as her personality and persona may turn me off, she is still admittedly a trailblazing musician as the first significant female bass guitarist. She didn't innovate much, but scores some points on impact and possesses tons of technical skill. Somewhere near the 40 spot seems about right.

Mike Watt: a shoo in in this group...near the top of it. Perhaps the most prolific bassist from the "punk" genre. Also enjoys great versatility and consistant skill set.

Phil Chen: Significant 60's and 70's bassist in British rock. Perhaps overlooked due to the major rock significance of some of the frontment he played with kept him in the background, but understands what the instrument can do...and does it himself. Great historian on the instrument.

Verdine White: Excellent player among several other funk players. Not at the top in that catagory, but fit quite well with the EW&F material and held his own in that talented ensemble.

Willie Weeks: Highely recognized among his bass peers. Not the most extensive discography....but some real significant work. His solo on the Donnie Hathaway Live album is one of the most hearalded bass solos in history. also...quite versatile, moving comfortably from R&B to Country to Rock, and everything in between.

Mike Rutherford: Never much excited me, but I've never listened real close to him.

Ronnie Baker: One of the most underrated guys on this list. Perhaps this site is just not real attuned to the Philly International sound (TSOP) which set the standard for soul music in the 70's, and helped usher in the Disco era. Ronnie was a true bass "arranger", and his groove was in the pocket solid. Just a sidenote that I just can't understand Ronnies locking partner, Earl Young is TOTALLY overlooked on the drum lists...a travesty. Earl is one of the most impactful drummers of the 70's...inventing and creating the four on the floor drum pattern which dominated the Disco era. I guess that just proves my point that DDD does not give much well deserved recognition to the Philly Sound which it certainly should. A GREAT group of musicians over there in the the 70's and beyond.

Whetton and Lake...like some of their bands. Never focused in too much to their playing. You guys will know better.


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 Post subject: Re: 100 Greatest Rock Bass Guitarists
PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2012 10:26 am 
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WHERES PINO??? This is starting to get NUTS again :cop:


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 Post subject: Re: 100 Greatest Rock Bass Guitarists
PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2012 12:52 pm 
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StuBass wrote:
WHERES PINO??? This is starting to get NUTS again :cop:


Certainly he belongs in the top 30 somewhere. If we are going to consider Mike Watt what about Norman Watt-Roy;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0WGVgfjnLqc&ob=av2n


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 Post subject: Re: 100 Greatest Rock Bass Guitarists
PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2012 3:26 pm 
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Neg just listened to your live Casady/Airplane performance with the indeed monster solo, and one of SanTropez's Lesh links. There's no question Lesh is more creative, with a more distinctive, hard to replicate, and idiosyncratic style. I could listen to these two all day though, they're both fucking geniuses, and I need to start buying albums from both bands soon


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 Post subject: Re: 100 Greatest Rock Bass Guitarists
PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2012 4:27 pm 
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Ariel wrote:
Neg just listened to your live Casady/Airplane performance with the indeed monster solo, and one of SanTropez's Lesh links. There's no question Lesh is more creative, with a more distinctive, hard to replicate, and idiosyncratic style. I could listen to these two all day though, they're both fucking geniuses, and I need to start buying albums from both bands soon


Well you're the bassist so I'll leave it up to you.

But in the meantime, check out Lesh's playing in this version of "The Other One" (track 17). Sweeeeet solo at around 15:25 too...
http://archive.org/details/gd1972-08-22 ... 27780.shnf

And this one for Casady:


Last edited by Negative Creep on Mon May 28, 2012 12:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: 100 Greatest Rock Bass Guitarists
PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2012 11:53 pm 
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Just thinking about the list and all that after receiving an e-mail from a friend, MFSB original guitarist and Philly Intl songwriter and producer Bobby Eli inquiring about Babbitts situation. Babbitt played a lot of sessions with MFSB after Ronnie Baker and some others left Philly Intl and MFSB to form the Salsoul Orchestra with percussionist Vince Montana and had some HUGE disco instrumental hits. Norman Harris, Ronnie Baker, and Earl Young also formed a production company and produced a lot of hits including the major disco hits by Earls group...The Trammps (remember Disco Inferno)...Earl on drums AND singing bass in the group. Earl could also dance in a way that would make James Brown stop and take notice.

NOW regarding Marcus Miller! I think # 50 would be a good spot. If the rankings were based on what Marcus does...he'd probably be top 5. But take out the Jazz, Fusion, and other shit he does...his rock/funk credentials are still incredible...thus #50 on the list me thinks...


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 Post subject: Re: 100 Greatest Rock Bass Guitarists
PostPosted: Tue May 29, 2012 4:49 pm 
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Ssoyd wrote:
Ariel wrote:
Odum is likely top 40 I think. As far as Thain goes, he'll get a respectable spot when we add him, but so far my plan has been to start adding people to the list after we're done ordering the current folks. Disagree?


Sounds reasonable but will we be discussing who should be dropped from the list to make room for more deserving players?


Yeah of course. Do you think Bill Wyman should stay?

StuBass wrote:
Carol Kaye: As much as her personality and persona may turn me off, she is still admittedly a trailblazing musician as the first significant female bass guitarist. She didn't innovate much, but scores some points on impact and possesses tons of technical skill. Somewhere near the 40 spot seems about right.


She's so hard to assess blah. Aside from being this list's token female, what else does she have that is significant? Playing Brian Wilson's written out parts that she didn't even come up with on Pet Sounds? Being the far distantly second place bassist in the Wrecking Crew? Did she even do extensive bass sessions as a member of the Crew, and was her playing any good when it wasn't Brian's written out parts? The fact that she's done some work in helping formalize electric bass studies by writing guide books? (And surely she must be below Rainey in terms of importance in that field...)

StuBass wrote:
Mike Watt: a shoo in in this group...near the top of it. Perhaps the most prolific bassist from the "punk" genre. Also enjoys great versatility and consistant skill set.


Stu listens to punk?! Hahaha

Yeah the little I've heard of Watt blows me away.

StuBass wrote:
Phil Chen: Significant 60's and 70's bassist in British rock. Perhaps overlooked due to the major rock significance of some of the frontment he played with kept him in the background, but understands what the instrument can do...and does it himself. Great historian on the instrument.


What do you mean by 'historian'

StuBass wrote:
Ronnie Baker: One of the most underrated guys on this list. Perhaps this site is just not real attuned to the Philly International sound (TSOP) which set the standard for soul music in the 70's, and helped usher in the Disco era. Ronnie was a true bass "arranger", and his groove was in the pocket solid. Just a sidenote that I just can't understand Ronnies locking partner, Earl Young is TOTALLY overlooked on the drum lists...a travesty. Earl is one of the most impactful drummers of the 70's...inventing and creating the four on the floor drum pattern which dominated the Disco era. I guess that just proves my point that DDD does not give much well deserved recognition to the Philly Sound which it certainly should. A GREAT group of musicians over there in the the 70's and beyond.


Unfortunately the Philly scene and sound are almost completely unheard of today, I'd literally never heard of it before you mentioned it. Blah.

What do you mean that Ronnie was a bass 'arranger'?

Earl should be high on the drummers list no question.

Ronnie's influence on bass is so important and pivotal, yeah, he's going to be raised a lot from his token current spot.

Ssoyd wrote:
StuBass wrote:
WHERES PINO??? This is starting to get NUTS again :cop:


Certainly he belongs in the top 30 somewhere. If we are going to consider Mike Watt what about Norman Watt-Roy;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0WGVgfjnLqc&ob=av2n


Impressed by this Watt-Roy. Also, that's the funkiest video I've ever seen!

Any more Watt-Roy samples my good man?

Reg. Pino there's literally no way he can even approach top 30. It would be unreasonable. I suspect he'll make top 50 though and has an outside shot at the top 40. Pino's really good but his innovations are somewhat minor and his style is not all THAT distinctive. His acclaim, respect, volume and versatility of recorded work are all through the roof though, as is his professionalism and his stature as one of the top contemporary bassists/bassists of the last few decades. His being chosen to play for The Who is also a huge feather in the cap and helps his placement here too. He's a musician's musician and that's also relevant. And he did play a significant role in popularizing the fretless in rock. All of this adds up to a healthy spot, but not top 30

Neg will check out those two links soon

Regarding Marcus...my instinct is to keep the issue 'tabled' for now, until we finish reordering the current names on the list/revising the current list.


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 Post subject: Re: 100 Greatest Rock Bass Guitarists
PostPosted: Tue May 29, 2012 4:56 pm 
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IDEA! Raise Lesh, Casady, and Bogert to above Sheehan, Jackson, and possibly Prestia and Osborn. Thoughts?

Thinking of putting Bootsy either at 20 (which would bump Burton to 21 and Harris to 22), 16 (bumping Sheehan down to 17...this is if we raise Lesh/Casady/Bogert higher too), 22 (below Burton and Harris but above Hamm & Deacon), or 25 (bumping down Dunn/Babbitt/Johnson/Abe).

Thoughts? Part of me wants to say Lesh, Casady, Bogert, Bootsy are all kind of similar, 'of a group' if you will, in terms of greatness (though Bootsy is definitely a step behind the other three), and surpass a guy like Sheehan or the rock side of Jackson.

BTW when we've finalized this top 30, I'm hitting up Lew to change the list on the main site to reflect our new one :-)


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 Post subject: Re: 100 Greatest Rock Bass Guitarists
PostPosted: Tue May 29, 2012 5:05 pm 
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Looking over the second half of the list, realizing like half of the names are almost certain to be dropped and aren't list worthy, hahaha. This is actually great news because it means we'll have room for the people who ought to be added after we drop the ones who don't deserve a spot on this list


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