Game of Thrones

chicken sandwich · **Joined:** Sun Oct 17, 2010 11:28 pm **Posts:** 2907

haven't there been 5 books released so far? It seems like that locks up the show for 5 more years, are you saying the newest book won't come out before 2018?

Jess · **Joined:** Wed Oct 13, 2010 10:22 pm **Posts:** 3792

The fifth season will begin in 3 years. If they want a reasonable amount of time to produce the 6th season, then the book has to come out around then to rewrite it into a screenplay to premier in 4 years. It took 5 years to write the 4th book and 6 for the the 5th book I think. So if he doesn't write faster, then there won't be any new material to film in 3-4 years. And even he does manage to get the 6th book out by then to be filmed, it would be miraculous if he wrote the 7th in time for filming in 5 years. The only way to account for this is to break up books 3 and 5 into two seasons each. Chances are he won't have them done and there will be a multi-year hiatus between seasons 5 and 6 unless the next 3 books are split up to more than 3 seasons. But that's bad too because then characters who are supposed to be 11-12 are going to be approaching 20 in real life.

corrections · **Joined:** Thu Oct 07, 2010 8:11 pm **Posts:** 14698

Jess wrote:

Forgotten Son wrote:

Jess wrote:

i really hope the show makes martin hurry his ass up and write the last 2 books because 1) even more people than his old pre-hbo readership will be pissed if they aren't done by the time the show catches up with the books

Martin never seems to have show that much concern over making his fanbase wait. In fact there seems to be a strong correlation between the size of his fanbase and the length of time it takes to write the next book in the series. We had to wait 5 years for A Feast For Crows and 6 for a Dance With Dragons all the while he was chatting on his blog about the Superbowl.

i know, and it sucks. i think the main catalyst now will be the show. if there's a 4 or 5 year period where it's off the air because he hasn't felt like writing much, more than just his fanbase will be pissed. it will also fuck up the characters, because arya's actress is going to be 20 when she's supposed to look 11. emilia clarke will be a 30 year old playing a 15 year old. i think he may have discussed this with hbo, and agreed that if they started the show in 2011, he would be able get out the last 2 books before the show caught up. or else i doubt hbo would have agreed to begin it last year.

i think the last 2 books were a huge challenge though, more than the first 3, since he had to split the narrative so carefully and couldn't figure out how much to include, and when to pick up where feast left off. i know with dance he did a jillion rewrites. with that out of the way i think he will be able to write the narrative a little more swiftly. i hope.

Note they addressed that already by adding a couple of years to the timeline between the overthrow and the first show (so Denarys is 17 at the start) and Arya is 11, Bran is 9 etc. But yes it will be quite a challenge if not much time passes.

Jess · **Joined:** Wed Oct 13, 2010 10:22 pm **Posts:** 3792

i just finished Dance. wow. if anyone else has read it i'd like to hear some theories. SPOILERS. really serious spoilers:

what do you think will happen to jon's story line? there's no way he's been eliminated from the narrative. reasons:

1) martin doesn't kill off major characters behind the scene. if jon was dead, it wouldn't end with "he felt cold..." we would know. i hope.

2) jon's a warg. if his body did in fact die, he is most definitely warged into ghost's body. his last thought was "Ghost". the prologue makes me think this is a possibility--where varamyr sixskins has warged into, but become stuck in a wolf's body.

3) melisandre was there wasn't she? or nearby. she has the hots for jon in more ways than one and not the sexual way. and she has powers. she could easily bring back a dead or dying jon, instilling him with the warmth of r'hllor or something. her presence pretty much ensures jon is not gone. i hope.

4) she seems to think jon is azor ahai reborn. azor ahai was the warrior who defeated the others thousands of years prior, after a long summer. if this prophecy isn't just hot air, it will play into jon being alive, or reborn in some incarnation of azor ahai. otherwise, what was the point of that prophecy? jon has too much significance.

5) also, it's just possible that he plainly didn't die from a few knife thrusts, and surrounded by wildings in his debt, it seems reasonable they took out jon's "brothers" and saved him. tormund would crush them. that's the boring straight forward theory.

in any case, it would not be sensical to end his pov completely. not because he's a likable character, but because he obviously has higher significance in the trajectory of the narrative. if jon is gone, we lose the wall's perspective. melisandre isn't enough to hold it together there and to be a window into its events. martin explores the land of always winter in book 6, so who the fuck is going there if not jon snow/azor ahai? also the fact that if it nips the potential ramsay v jon clash--battle of the bastards--in the bud before it even started would be bullshit. i'm tired of ramsay becoming such a dominant force in the north. i would like him to die soon, hopefully at the hands of theon.

and stannis? i think that part is a bluff on ramsay's part. stannis can't be dead, or it makes the last couple asha chapters pointless--the braavosi showing up with theon, and the karstarks, and there was never even a hint of a battle until the letter. i don't understand how he figured out who mance rayder was though, or how mance was dumb enough to get caught by ramsay fucking snow.

it looks like varys set the stage for aegon to raze king's landing, and essentially removing the lannisters from power and creating probably too much instability to keep the realm loyal.

i want to see how sansa reenters the picture after her training with littlefinger. i want to know what the fuck is up with jamie, brienne, the hound, and zombie catelyn stark. where is arya's plotline heading?

i liked theon's development a lot in this book. he's going to be an awesome character moving forward. ser barristan selmy is a badass.

Jess · **Joined:** Wed Oct 13, 2010 10:22 pm **Posts:** 3792

SPOILERS

a theory i think is pretty sound:

jon is the son of rhaegar targaryen and lyanna stark. it adds up nicely, chronologically, motivationally, circumstantially, and ned being ned.

jon was born during the rebellion. it began when rhaegar took lyanna to the tower of joy, where ned eventually showed up to rescue her. rhaegar's motives were unclear. but she was kept there for around a year. by the time ned got there, she was dying "in a pool of blood", but how she died is never revealed. the only people who knew the truth are all dead except for howland reed, who went to the tower of joy with ned.

it sounds as if she died in childbirth. and there are some in the novels who thought rhaegar had a thing with lyanna, him forsaking elia of dorne, and her robert baratheon. rhaegar by all accounts was an honorable, loved individual. it doesn't make sense that he kidnapped her to provoke robert baratheon out of malice. it makes more sense that there was an unspoken love dynamic. rhaegar had her stay there when she hypothetically became pregnant. ned, finding her as she's dying from childbirth, conceals the child and her cause of death, knowing full well that the baby would be the heir to throne and that he was committing treason, but choosing to honor his family by protecting his dying sister's only child instead. then he has a convenient cover story about how he knocked up a sailor's wench and felt all guilty and responsible. perhaps he did have an actual affair, and realized its potential utility.

lyanna stark has dark hair, and offhand at one point, a character mentions to jon that he looks more like his aunt lyanna than ned compared to his five trueborn children. it would account for jon's lack of resemblance to ned, and his dark hair when rhaegar had silvery-gold hair.

it makes sense that ned would be so hush hush about jon's origins and avoid talking about it with anyone. if it was a serving wench, then whatever, let the truth be known and move on. he knew how dangerous giving any hint to jon's true origins would be, and thought it better to conceal it until the time was right, if there would be a time at all.

also, there is the azor ahai parallel. rhaegar was thought to be azor ahai reborn by many. maester aemon (his great uncle) even thought so. now it seems jon is the favorite to be azor ahai by melisandre, who knows her shit when it comes to flames and light and such. and it makes sense. whenever she has visions of azor ahai, they are always obscured by snow. the parallels are uncanny.

this theory fills in all of the holes that surround the rhaegar--lyanna dynamic, the mystery surrounding her death, the mystery of jon's true origins, his prophetic link to azor ahai, etc.

jons snow is not dead, and he is jon targaryen-stark, heir to the iron throne, king of the seven kingdoms, and azor ahai reborn. that would be pretty dope. also dany gets lame and i don't want her to rule alone, though it seems aegon has beat her to the punch.

Jess · **Joined:** Wed Oct 13, 2010 10:22 pm **Posts:** 3792

favorite characters in the books:

jamie
jon
tyrion
theon
selmy
arya

more minor, non-pov ones:

the hound
bronn
beric dondarrion
qhorin halfhand
mance
jaqen
the dragons
ghost
melisandre
strong belwas
val
jon connington
rhaegar (from what we learn)

favorites in the show:

robb
tyrion
arya
jamie
theon
jon
jeor mormont
selmy
benjen
bronn
syrio forell
tywin
the hound

least favorites:

joff
cersei
sansa (though she slowly improves and i suspect she will be pretty cool in winds of winter)
ramsay snow
lord bolton
all of the freys oh my god
the mountain
bran
quentyn martell
hizdahr zo loraq
grand maester pycelle
most of the kingsguard
victarion (just a haughty prick with a little brother inferiority complex)
lancel lannister
randyll tarly
janos slynt
the tyrells seem pretty lame in general

Itlan · **Joined:** Sun Oct 24, 2010 12:49 pm **Posts:** 1820

Theon really becomes such a great character.

Jess · **Joined:** Wed Oct 13, 2010 10:22 pm **Posts:** 3792

have you read all 5?

here's a good interview with the directors about the new season:

http://insidetv.ew.com/2012/03/30/game-of-thrones-showrunners-season-2/

there aren't any big spoilers to worry about. they're careful to avoid specifics. read it if you're interested in their thoughts on the actors, pacing, what to add or cut out and how it differs from the book (nothing too specific), the locations, how they shot difficult scenes, etc. it's really interesting.

they're really excited about seasons 3-4, and to shoot the biggest scenes in Swords. i can't wait to see how they handle them, if we're thinking about the same scenes. and they are in fact splitting up Swords into 2 seasons. good. that means they'll probably do feast + dance in 3, and perhaps carry the end of dance into book 6.

Sherick · **Posted:** Sat Mar 31, 2012 11:27 pm

Itlan · **Joined:** Sun Oct 24, 2010 12:49 pm **Posts:** 1820

No I haven't finished all 5. I'm about to finish A Clash of Kings, which is what I'm referring to as far as Theon's character development.

I'm also beginning to really like The Hound as well.

pink · **Joined:** Tue Oct 12, 2010 6:42 pm **Posts:** 4988

Tonight

Jess · **Joined:** Wed Oct 13, 2010 10:22 pm **Posts:** 3792

IT IS HERE

ffffffff i have a test in the morning and can't decide if i should watch and study or watch after the test.

this is hilarious.

Sherick · **Posted:** Sun Apr 01, 2012 12:49 pm

Fuck the white man, and fuck his books.

Itlan · **Joined:** Sun Oct 24, 2010 12:49 pm **Posts:** 1820

I threw my book in the garbage when he killed Eddard. Then I threw it in there against when he killed Khal Drogo. Basically it took me like a year to finish the very final pieces of A Game of Thrones cause George R. R. Martin can go fuck himself.

Sherick · **Posted:** Sun Apr 01, 2012 1:48 pm

I was far more upset by Drogo than by Ned. Ned's is a shock for sure, but he'd been a lame duck for a couple eps and really his character started infuriating me. Funny, since Drogo was made to be the story's most crucial antagonist thus far, but I felt much more attracted to him and his relationship with Dany.
The only thing worse for me would have been if Tyrion died. /show

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