No. Just no. You're trolling.

I disagree , you have to take in the opinions of guys who arent in love with the classic rock stuff

chuck berry holds up better than a non white aor audience,

but I will say guys like slash and angus etc use his double stop licks and things of that nature all the time,

I dont know how well dylan reached the non AOR audience although stevie wonder covered blowing in the wind,I am not sure its as much as berry is revered in the AOR audience,

both guys do well in the country rock category ,neither are sampled in hip hop, none are sampled in metal ,berry is more revered in punk and rockabilly circles,singer song writer category is easily dylan, neither make a dent in jazz rock,or in funk,neither do well in latin rock and blues rock is more so berry

....so if you add up the categories in the most acclaimed circle amongst all of rocks sub genres ,the acclaimed edge is slighty towards berry

You want a rebuttal? Ok:

Huh? What? Are you implying that Bob Dylan is classic rock?

yes bob dylan fits the AOR classic rock description and his music is on AOR radio more than any other station, its also questionable that some of the stuff he writes is even considered rock



What?


what I meant, is some is while bob dylan wouldnt fly with the punk rock scene of the 70's chuck berrys music fit right in, and fans of AOR can appreciate the music of chuck berry that make sense.



That has almost nothing to do with songwriting .

the double stop bend intro , yeah it does, if you start your song that same way your a biting chuck, not to mention the thing he does where he alternates between the 5 and 6th chords during the verses, if your verses are like that you are biting chuck, if you are writing songs that emphasize youth and what its like for a teen you are biting chuck , hell if you are writing rock songs around the guitar you are doing so thanks to chuck, hes alot bigger than you think.


I'm fairly certain Dylan is acclaimed all around, unlike Berry who doesn't do very well with a lot of people, not just the "AOR audience"

he did well with the beatles, he did well with the stones ,he did well with guns and roses, he did well with hendrix, he did well enough for a crowd to demand an encore and deny pink floyd a chance to hit the stage, you prog rock geeks dont like him ,but you guys are minority audience as well.


wtf are you trying to say here?

I listed many of rocks sub genres and try to objectively evaluate if how they influenced each of those genres or impacted them with their song writing, does that make sense.


There is literally no way Berry is more acclaimed than Bob Dylan in any way except making samey old guitar riffs.

you sir are ignorant ,

you seem to be angry and uptight, those are the traits of lonely insecure anti social young males, guy the world is full of opportunity, women to mess with, songs to dance to, places to have adventures, you are too bogged down with this list, like you get paid to debate and or post on here, it boggles the mind.

Well yeah, it was one of your first posts.

Is anyone really disputing that Chuck Berry isn't more influential than Dylan in songwriting? Influence is clearly Berry, while acclaim is clearly Dylan. Acclaim does not mean the opinions of random fans: it's the aggregation of the opinions of the music critic community, and I say Dylan is more revered by critics. They gush about his songwriting all the time, while critics rarely wax poetic over Berry's composing. Popularity is sort of iffy, but they at least tie in it. Even if Berry has a slight lead in popularity and a moderate lead in influence (both of which I doubt), Dylan's total owning of the acclaim category is more than enough to make up for that.

Also, mrsamtotheg, your refusal to submit evidence beyond generalized statements has to stop. If you want Berry to improve in the criteria, you'll have to provide something to back up your arguments. In my opinion, Berry is just slightly ahead in influence (Dylan's myriad contributions are cumulatively close to Berry's one main contribution), very behind in acclaim (though of no fault of his own; no one songwriter comes close to Dylan's acclaim), and at least ties in popularity (Dylan remains popular until today, while Berry was arguably more popular initially).

Please rebutt with concrete statements.

Is anyone really disputing that Chuck Berry isn't more influential than Dylan in songwriting? Influence is clearly Berry,

you got to get it together , since when does one guy win one category and still wins the overall debate, or acheives the higher ranking,

No way. There are far more songs and songwriters which are clearly Dylanesque (the mere fact that that's a common term speaks volumes) than are in Berry's style. Berry has a lot of influence, but Dylan has more. Dylan was important in pushing rock songwriters in new directions (it's hard to see where the Beatles would have gone without him) and virtually every singer-songwriter of the late 60s/early 70s owes an enormous debt to Dylan.

oh yeah the beatles, if you look at songs like I saw her standing there, I want to hold your hand ,come together , revolution, back in the usa, one after 909,get back, roll over beethoven,etc, yeah those are dylanesque right

and rock n roll by led zep yeah that was all dylan right there totally went away from that chuck berry sound, as mc5 back in the usa cover and american ruse their own original song , as well the sound of the ramones,punks biggest band , sounds exactly like dylan, berrys sound totally was extinct by the 70's , hendrix cover of johnny b goode, was played bob dylan style too.

was redone ina dylanesque kinda way, even guys like the stooges that song raw power, just that guitar is so clearly bob dylan , even buddy hollys oh boy, the way he strums the guitar verses and the tempo, it was inspired by dylan before he came out, and even something like welcome to the jungle , I mean the way it starts with a guitar riff as an intro then fades in the rest of the band its sounds so similiar to something chuck has done like brown eyed handsome man ,same can be said for you shook me all night long and highway to hell by ac dc , 19th nervous breakdown by the stones using a guitar riff an intro its probaly no big deal for those records though, cuz for the rest of those records you hear that dominate bob dylan influence,right, even in a bob dylan song like obviously 5 believers ,and tombstone blues sound like those guitar riffs are something bob dylan thought up on his own, Im sure he didnt get that from chuck but from his own creative genius,right.

He's talking about their later career, eg. Sgt. Pepper's, Revolver, etc. Their early stuff takes a cue from Berry, sure, but Buddy Holly was way more influential on the Beatles than Berry was.




See, now you're the one getting worked up by the lists. Dylan has more influence than Berry, doesn't mean that Berry's style died after Dylan or that Berry's songs were never covered. Bringing up a bunch of short, guitar-driven rock and roll songs/covers by other famous artists doesn't help your point and it doesn't bring down Brett Alan's.



I know you're getting your panties in a knot because people are daring to question your beloved Chuck Berry, but this paragraph is ridiculous. Did you even pay attention to what Brett said or are you just bringing up guitar-based songs and trying to claim that it's all Chuck?