DDD Home Page
DDD Music Lists Page
DDD Movie Lists Page
It is currently Wed Aug 20, 2014 3:26 pm

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 35 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: 100 Greatest Philosophical Novels
PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2011 5:44 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2010 2:09 pm
Posts: 1162
Wikipedia defined a philosophical novel as "works of fiction in which a significant proportion of the work is devoted to a discussion of the sort of questions normally addressed in discursive philosophy." Not sure if I can even think of 100 of them, but here's a preliminary list:

1. Thus Spoke Zarathustra - Friedrich Nietzche
2. Candide - Voltaire
3. Atlas Shrugged - Ayn Rand
4. The Stranger - Albert Camus
5. Notes from Underground - Fyodor Dostoevsky
6. Nausea - Jean-Paul Sartre
7. Hayy ibn Yaqzan (Philosophus Autodidactus) - Ibn Tufail


For purposes of this list, I'm not counting Greek philosophical discussions (like Plato's Republic) and religious texts. And yes, I do hate Ayn Rand.

Also, I'm not sure about some works that are borderline philosophical novels, like "A Clockwork Orange" and "The Brothers Karamazov."


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 100 Greatest Philosophical Novels
PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2011 7:24 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2010 6:29 pm
Posts: 1071
Location: Greg's place
well, they're all essentially intellectual wankery so who cares? Add whatever you want.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 100 Greatest Philosophical Novels
PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2011 8:40 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Oct 11, 2010 6:22 pm
Posts: 6616
Location: Matthew McConaughey has won the Oscar for Best Actor in-- "You think you know me..." Shit.
Yes, everybody's political leaning should most certainly influence this list.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 100 Greatest Philosophical Novels
PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2011 9:14 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2010 11:11 pm
Posts: 5263
Location: Just a humble motherfucker with a big ass dick.
Camus's The Outsider?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 100 Greatest Philosophical Novels
PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2011 9:23 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2010 6:29 pm
Posts: 1071
Location: Greg's place
was my next thought.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 100 Greatest Philosophical Novels
PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2011 9:25 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2010 10:11 am
Posts: 5858
Sherick wrote:
Yes, everybody's political leaning should most certainly influence this list.

What makes a great philosophical novel? If respect from the actual philosophical community matters, then Ayn Rand scores so abysmally low in that category that there is simply no way she sniffs the top ten, regardless of her popularity.

Quinnsy Lohan wrote:
Camus's The Outsider?

see #4

But The Plague should definitely be up there, as should The Fall


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 100 Greatest Philosophical Novels
PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2011 9:30 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2010 6:29 pm
Posts: 1071
Location: Greg's place
i love how there's always been an anti-Rand thing here.
You'd be able to tell, even if no one had said anything :P


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 100 Greatest Philosophical Novels
PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2011 9:45 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2010 2:09 pm
Posts: 1162
Which is also why I included that disclaimer at the bottom. But I'd think influence on the course of philosophy and popularity should be factors. What would you recommend knocking Rand down to, and what should fill the rest of the Top 10?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 100 Greatest Philosophical Novels
PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2011 9:56 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2010 10:11 am
Posts: 5858
There's no way to know until I have some idea of what's going to be on the list. But for example, much of what I talk about below should be higher than her (Dost, Kafka, Tolstoy).

I think Brothers K should make the list (and very high, higher than Notes for sure) because of its importance in philosophy of religion and existentialism.

The Plague and The Fall by Camus would probably both be in a top 100.

Kafka's The Trial and The Metamorphosis as well.

Les Mis, War & Peace, Anna Karenina, and arguably Don Quixote are worth considering, though the latter especially blends the line between simply fiction and philosophical fiction (something that's going to confound efforts to build this list).

And what about someone like Parmenides, whose philosophical output was contained in a poem?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 100 Greatest Philosophical Novels
PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2011 11:57 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2010 2:09 pm
Posts: 1162
I wouldn't say Don Quixote should be on here because it's more of a satire on heroicism. Like read my initial post to figure out what I mean by "philosophical novel." And no, a poem is not a novel, so Parmenides isn't eligible for this list.

Les Mis and Anna Karenina could probably be on here. Kafka should definitely be on here if he is eligible, but it's very hard to find a specific philosophy in his work.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 100 Greatest Philosophical Novels
PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 12:32 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2010 6:29 pm
Posts: 1071
Location: Greg's place
beaverteeth92 wrote:
Which is also why I included that disclaimer at the bottom. But I'd think influence on the course of philosophy and popularity should be factors. What would you recommend knocking Rand down to, and what should fill the rest of the Top 10?


I meant a more esoteric jab at our population. Sorry.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 100 Greatest Philosophical Novels
PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 2:48 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2010 11:06 am
Posts: 5209
My personal opinion is that this is too fuzzy a "genre" to merit this sort of list. What qualifies something as being philosophical? Pnoom mentioned Kafka, but I don't think he's much of a philosopher. And what great novelist doesn't venture into philosophy? The inclusion of one's worldview is inevitable in the very process of writing. Every novel is a work that puts forward the author's philosophy.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 100 Greatest Philosophical Novels
PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 3:35 am 
Offline

Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2010 2:09 pm
Posts: 1162
I specifically defined what's eligible for this list and what's not though at the beginning of my post. The novel has to practically be a philosophical discourse.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 100 Greatest Philosophical Novels
PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 9:47 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2010 10:29 pm
Posts: 1090
Location: Louisville, KY
I agree with Pnoom, Brother Karamazov should for sure be in the top five.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: 100 Greatest Philosophical Novels
PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 10:11 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2010 10:11 am
Posts: 5858
beaverteeth92 wrote:
I specifically defined what's eligible for this list and what's not though at the beginning of my post. The novel has to practically be a philosophical discourse.

If we're going for this strict a requirement, then we'll probably end up with more like 25 than 100.

Of the ones discussed so far, I think the top four has to be (though the order could change, but these seem like a clear top 4):

1. Nietzsche - Thus Spoke Zarathustra
2. Dostoevsky - The Brothers Karamazov
3. Voltaire - Candide
4. Camus - The Outsider

The Plague, Notes from Underground, War & Peace, Nausea, The Trial, and The Metamorphosis could all potentially be top 10, depending on what else is included.

Somewhere lower down on the list should probably be Lewis' Screwtape Letters.

Would Kierkegaard's Either/Or count? It's presented as if it's excerpts from some people's diaries. It's much less like a novel than Sartre's Nausea, but the similarity is enough to make it worth asking. If it's included, it should probably be top 2.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 35 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:

DigitalDreamDoor.com   

Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group

DigitalDreamDoor Forum is one part of a music and movie list website whose owner has given its visitors
the privilege to discuss music and movies, and has no control and cannot in any way be held liable over
how, or by whom this board is used. If you read or see anything inappropriate that has been posted,
contact webmaster@digitaldreamdoor.com. Comments in the forum are reviewed before list updates.
Topics include rock music, metal, rap, hip-hop, blues, jazz, songs, albums, guitar, drums, musicians...


DDD Home Page | DDD Music Lists Page | DDD Movie Lists Page