DDD Home Page
DDD Music Lists Page
DDD Movie Lists Page
It is currently Mon Sep 01, 2014 1:43 pm

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 3987 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 145, 146, 147, 148, 149, 150, 151 ... 266  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: NBA.
PostPosted: Sun Aug 12, 2012 3:00 pm 
Offline
moderator
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2010 7:55 pm
Posts: 16417
Location: The Capital of the Free World
Here is a list of media markets by size (*playoff team)

1 New York*
2 Los Angeles**
3 Chicago*
4 Philadelphia*
5 Dallas-Ft. Worth*
6 San Francisco-Oakland-San Jose
7 Boston*
8 Atlanta*
9 Washington, DC
10 Houston
11 Detroit
12 Phoenix
15 Minneapolis-St. Paul
16 Miami-Ft.Lauderdale*
17 Cleveland-Akron
18 Denver*
19 Orlando-Daytona Beach-Melbourne*
20 Sacramento-Stockton-Modesto
22 Portland, OR
24 Charlotte, NC
25 Indianapolis*
33 Salt Lake City*
35 Milwaukee
37 San Antonio*
45 Oklahoma City*
48 Memphis*
53 New Orleans

I think the so-called small markets can compete.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: NBA.
PostPosted: Sun Aug 12, 2012 3:24 pm 
Offline
moderator
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2010 7:55 pm
Posts: 16417
Location: The Capital of the Free World
This is becoming a masturbatory exercise, but NBA teams by Gross Metro Product of their metro region.

1 New York Metropolitan Area*
2 Los Angeles Metropolitan Area**
3 Chicago Metropolitan Area*
4 Washington Metropolitan Area
5 Greater Houston
6 Dallas–Fort Worth–Arlington*
7 Delaware Valley (Philadelphia)*
8 San Francisco Bay Area
9 Greater Boston*
10 Atlanta Metropolitan Area*
11 South Florida Metropolitan Area (Miami)*
13 Minneapolis – Saint Paul
14 Metro Detroit
15 Phoenix Metropolitan Area
18 Denver Metropolitan Area*
21 Portland metropolitan area
24 Charlotte metropolitan area
27 Greater Cleveland
28 Indianapolis metropolitan area*
29 Greater Orlando*
32 Greater Sacramento
37 Milwaukee metropolitan area*
38 Greater San Antonio*
41 New Orleans metropolitan area
42 Salt Lake City metropolitan area*
44 Memphis metropolitan area*
48 Oklahoma City Metro*


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: NBA.
PostPosted: Sun Aug 12, 2012 3:35 pm 
Online
moderator
User avatar

Joined: Thu Oct 07, 2010 3:51 pm
Posts: 8587
Location: the undiscovered country
granted this may have to do with the number of teams in the playoffs every year, but there i think are only 3 teams who haven't made the playoffs in the last 5 years (Minny, Washington, Sacro from my count, although i didn't look that up to confirm).

after a decade of overspending in NY with nothing to show for it (until the last 2 years) and decades of horrible play from the Clips (until luck handed them a number 1 pick), i think its clear that ownership/GM have the biggest hand in how competitive a team is. granted, those big market teams always grab the headline star. but that has always been the case. back to Wilt, Kareem, Shaq, etc. there is nothing different about LeBron or Howard going to "destination" cities. the only reason why Jordan, Bird and Magic didn't do it was because they were already there. and really, this extends far beyond sports. hell, i personally headed straight for a huge market after school (chicago). its just what people do. the big cities are attractive for tons of reasons. but these guys like LeBron, Shaq, Wilt, Kareem: they are once in a generation players anyway.

people will point to '10 and say "what about Amare? Bosh? etc". the reason that happened in '10 was because the teams with the most capspace were the teams trying to pry away LeBron and Wade. so when they didn't get them, they went after Amare, Boozer, etc.

i think what people forget about Pau and D-Will is that these guys didn't force their way to big markets. they wanted out of bad situations and the teams that went after them hardest were big market teams. NJ made the best offer for D-Will, end of story. the Pau trade was obviously fishy, but that had little to do with market-size and much more to do with GM friendliness/loyalty. same with KG. and they had to fucking pry KG away with a crowbar to get him to leave for Boston.


the interesting thing about that list is Cleveland being side-by-side with Miami. but when we have this argument, everyone just says "yeah, well Miami has the night life and the weather and the state tax benefit and etc etc". and my only answer is "well yeah. that's the point, isn't it?"


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: NBA.
PostPosted: Sun Aug 12, 2012 4:43 pm 
Offline
moderator

Joined: Thu Oct 07, 2010 8:11 pm
Posts: 22506
pgm wrote:
lonewolf371 wrote:
Check out the Forbes valuations. I think the Marlins are close to last in MLB revenue, but the Heat are top ten in value. That's a huge disparity in resources which means that they can't be counted the same in both sports.


That's why I say it's more than market size. The Marlins fans are put off by bad management. It's not that Heat fans are more loyal (the thought is ridiculous). It's that the Heat owners have turned the franchise into a desirable brand name largely through attracting talent. It's something any team could theoretically replicate it.


Any team with the south beach weather and no state tax environment.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: NBA.
PostPosted: Sun Aug 12, 2012 4:45 pm 
Offline
moderator

Joined: Thu Oct 07, 2010 8:11 pm
Posts: 22506
pgm wrote:
batman wrote:
With market size, I think you can also look at how many teams there are in the area. The Portland-metro area is about the same size as Sacramento, but I know a pretty good amount of people from Sacramento who say when the Kings are bad they just root for the Warriors, or move on to a different sport and root for the Giants, the A's, the Sharks, The 49ers, the Raiders, Cal, Stanford, whoever's doing the best, really. Portland feels like a bigger market than Sacramento to me because when the Blazers are doing poorly, we can either suck it up and keep watching basketball or watch MLS and college football instead.


That's a good point. I'm not sure if that makes Portland a comparatively big market or small, though. I guess my problem with people blaming it on the market size is that big market teams often do terribly. I think bigger factors are a tradition of winning (see: Pittsburgh) and getting lucky (see: Chicago in the '80s and the Heat in the '00s).

Anyway, I'm going to see if I can define the big markets. Miami is clearly a premier city, even if it's not that big.


What you're ignoring is the margin for error being a big market gives you and the ability to load up additional players for a stretch run. San Antonio and OKC are two examples of sterling management that built consistent winners. Even OKC though hasn't had a long string of true title contenders (of course they will because of how lucky they got with Durant and Westbrook). San Antonio is the only small market team (and they're still in the 7th largest city in the United States) that has managed to have sustained status as a contender.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: NBA.
PostPosted: Sun Aug 12, 2012 4:51 pm 
Offline
moderator

Joined: Thu Oct 07, 2010 8:11 pm
Posts: 22506
pave wrote:
granted this may have to do with the number of teams in the playoffs every year, but there i think are only 3 teams who haven't made the playoffs in the last 5 years (Minny, Washington, Sacro from my count, although i didn't look that up to confirm).

after a decade of overspending in NY with nothing to show for it (until the last 2 years) and decades of horrible play from the Clips (until luck handed them a number 1 pick), i think its clear that ownership/GM have the biggest hand in how competitive a team is. granted, those big market teams always grab the headline star. but that has always been the case. back to Wilt, Kareem, Shaq, etc. there is nothing different about LeBron or Howard going to "destination" cities. the only reason why Jordan, Bird and Magic didn't do it was because they were already there. and really, this extends far beyond sports. hell, i personally headed straight for a huge market after school (chicago). its just what people do. the big cities are attractive for tons of reasons. but these guys like LeBron, Shaq, Wilt, Kareem: they are once in a generation players anyway.

people will point to '10 and say "what about Amare? Bosh? etc". the reason that happened in '10 was because the teams with the most capspace were the teams trying to pry away LeBron and Wade. so when they didn't get them, they went after Amare, Boozer, etc.

i think what people forget about Pau and D-Will is that these guys didn't force their way to big markets. they wanted out of bad situations and the teams that went after them hardest were big market teams. NJ made the best offer for D-Will, end of story. the Pau trade was obviously fishy, but that had little to do with market-size and much more to do with GM friendliness/loyalty. same with KG. and they had to fucking pry KG away with a crowbar to get him to leave for Boston.


the interesting thing about that list is Cleveland being side-by-side with Miami. but when we have this argument, everyone just says "yeah, well Miami has the night life and the weather and the state tax benefit and etc etc". and my only answer is "well yeah. that's the point, isn't it?"


Miami is also substantially wealthier than Cleveland (although with a less engaged sports base). The thing people are missing though that's of crucial importance is how big it is to have one to two stars in basketball and how few of those exist. And because of the max salary system it makes it very easy for players to cluster in these teams. For example lets say the Nets had approached Lebron but instead of offering him his max salary (of which he took I think a 2 to 3 million haircut off what he could make) they offered him 30 million dollars per year. Now Lebron would be worth spending roughly that amount of your cap and there is no way in hell he takes a around 10 million dollar paycut (or so) to go to Miami.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: NBA.
PostPosted: Sun Aug 12, 2012 5:27 pm 
Offline
moderator
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2010 7:55 pm
Posts: 16417
Location: The Capital of the Free World
corrections wrote:
Any team with the south beach weather and no state tax environment.


I'll admit those are special factors. But I think that just lends credibility that it's not about market size. There are three or four premier locations in the NBA (New York, LA, Miami, ?). After that, it's not really about the market size, but about the franchise. People want to play in Chicago because it's where Michael Jordan played. I don't see anyone fighting to play in Philadelphia, despite being one of the largest cities in the country. And even then, ownership trumps all of that. Miami was not a big NBA destination until Wade and LeBron played together in the Olympics and decided to team up one day. Dwight Howard's been desperate to get out of Orlando, but because the ownership sucked, not because Orlando is the sticks (most of his desired teams were big markets, but again, I don't believe Philadelphia was on the list).

OK, I'm not going to beat the point, because I think we're probably approaching agreement. I think there are reasons why Miami and other cities started pooling talent (and you named many of them).


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: NBA.
PostPosted: Mon Aug 13, 2012 1:27 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Dec 09, 2010 8:42 pm
Posts: 3117
Location: I AINT PLAYIN NUGGA
Jodie Meeks and Earl Clark coming to the Lakers too apparently, pretty sweet. Insane starting 5, and a bench that is much better than last year's, cot damn.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: NBA.
PostPosted: Mon Aug 13, 2012 8:53 am 
Offline
moderator
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2010 7:55 pm
Posts: 16417
Location: The Capital of the Free World
I like Meeks. He's not a great player, but I think he's good off the bench. He'll hit the occasional three, run the floor and isn't a bad defender. He was our best defender against Dwyane Wade. Unfortunately, he's terribly inconsistent.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: NBA.
PostPosted: Fri Aug 24, 2012 1:59 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2010 2:07 am
Posts: 7948
Location: Seattle
it's August so, uh...what does everyone think of this list?

Best NBA Uniforms

Personally I think Chicago's jerseys are the best in the NBA. I also think the Rockets have the most boring unis in pro sports.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: NBA.
PostPosted: Sun Aug 26, 2012 11:22 am 
Online
User avatar

Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2010 9:07 am
Posts: 6394
Even though I'm a Bulls fan I think their unis are just average. I absolutely love the Lakers uniforms (all of them) and think they are the 4th best in sports (though I think I'm in the minority).


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: NBA.
PostPosted: Tue Sep 04, 2012 1:03 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2010 2:07 am
Posts: 7948
Location: Seattle
everyone already knowz this

http://hangtime.blogs.nba.com/2012/09/0 ... d=nba.2013


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: NBA.
PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 5:29 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2010 2:07 am
Posts: 7948
Location: Seattle
so who else is pumped for the 'ZERS this year?!?!

ImageImageImage


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: NBA.
PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 12:59 am 
Offline
moderator
User avatar

Joined: Thu Oct 07, 2010 11:43 am
Posts: 4662
i'm pumped for the timberwolves: love, pekovic, rubio, kirilenko, shved, roy
(+barea, derrick williams, mozgov)

amazingly, they've managed to become whiter than utah jazz.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: NBA.
PostPosted: Thu Sep 20, 2012 2:51 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2010 2:07 am
Posts: 7948
Location: Seattle
RIP CITY
ImageImage
ImageImage


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 3987 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 145, 146, 147, 148, 149, 150, 151 ... 266  Next

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bruno and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
cron

DigitalDreamDoor.com   

Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group

DigitalDreamDoor Forum is one part of a music and movie list website whose owner has given its visitors
the privilege to discuss music and movies, and has no control and cannot in any way be held liable over
how, or by whom this board is used. If you read or see anything inappropriate that has been posted,
contact webmaster@digitaldreamdoor.com. Comments in the forum are reviewed before list updates.
Topics include rock music, metal, rap, hip-hop, blues, jazz, songs, albums, guitar, drums, musicians...


DDD Home Page | DDD Music Lists Page | DDD Movie Lists Page