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 Post subject: Greatest Operas
PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2010 7:02 pm 
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Greatest Operas

1. Der Ring des Nibelungen – Richard Wagner
2. Tristan Und Isolde – Richard Wagner
3. Don Giovanni – Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart
4. Otello – Giuseppe Verdi
5. The Marriage of Figaro – Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart
6. Aida – Giuseppe Verdi
7. La Boheme – Giacomo Puccini
8. Madame Butterfly – Giacomo Puccini
9. Der Rosenkavalier – Richard Strauss
10. Parsifal – Richard Wagner
11. Boris Godunov – Modest Mussorgsky
12. La Traviata – Giuseppe Verdi
13. Carmen – Georges Bizet
14. Die Meistersinger – Richard Wagner
15. The Magic Flute – Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart
16. Tosca – Giacomo Puccini
17. Falstaff – Giuseppe Verdi
18. Rigoletto – Giuseppe Verdi
19. The Barber Of Seville – Gioacchino Rossini
20. Cavalleria Rusticana – Pietro Mascagni
21. Il Trovatore – Giuseppe Verdi
22. Turandot – Giacomo Puccini
23. Faust – Charles Gounod
24. Lohengrin – Richard Wagner
25. Peter Grimes – Benjamin Britten
26. Norma – Vincenzo Bellini
27. Tannhauser – Richard Wagner
28. I Pagliacci – Rugierro Leoncavallo
29. Pelleas and Mellisande – Claude Debussy
30. Porgy & Bess – George Gershwin
31. Lucia Di Lammermoor – Gaetano Donizetti
32. Les Troyens – Hector Berlioz
33. Elektra – Richard Strauss
34. Cosi Fan Tutte – Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart
35. Fidelio – Ludwig Van Beethoven
36. Eugene Onegin – Peter Illitch Tchaikovsky
37. La Gioconda – Amiliare Ponchielli
38. Wozzeck – Alban Berg **
39. Incoronazione di Poppea – Claudio Monteverdi **
40. Salome – Richard Strauss
41. Dido and Aneas – Henry Purcell
42. The Cunning Little Vixen – Leos Janacek **
43. Orpheus and Eurydice – Christoph Willibald Gluck
44. Don Carlos – Giuseppe Verdi
45. Orfeo – Claudio Monteverdi
46. Der Freischutz – Carl Maria von Weber
47. Samson and Delilah – Camille Saint-Saens
48. Tales of Hoffman – Jacques Offenbach
49. Hansel and Gretel – Engelbert Humperdink
50. The Flying Dutchman – Richard Wagner
51. The Rake's Progress – Igor Stravinsky
52. Manon – Jules Massenet
53. The Bartered Bride – Bedrich Smetana
54. The Huguenots – Giacomo Meyerbeer
55. La Forza Del Destino – Giuseppe Verdi
56. Manon Lescaut – Giacomo Puccini
57. Ariadne auf Naxos – Richard Strauss
58. Romeo and Juliet – Charles Gounod
59. L'Elisir D'Amore – Gaetano Donizetti
60. Lakme – Leo Delibes
61. Andre Chenier – Umberto Giordano
62. Werther – Jules Massenet
63. Don Pasquale – Gaetano Donizetti
64. Jenufa – Leos Janacek **
65. The Girl of the Golden West – Giacomo Puccini
66. La Sonnambula – Vincenzo Bellini
67. Turn of the Screw – Benjamin Britten **
68. Duke Bluebeard’s Castle – Bela Bartok **
69. William Tell – Gioacchino Rossini
70. The Masked Ball – Giuseppe Verdi
71. Julius Caesar – Georg Friedrich Handel **
72. La Serva Padrona – Giovanni Pergolesi **
73. Die Tote Stadt – Erich Wolfgang Korngold
74. Louise – Gustave Charpentier **
75. Mefistofele – Arrigo Boito
76. I Puritani – Vincenzo Bellini
77. Semiramide – Gioacchino Rossini
78. L'Africaine – Giacomo Meyerbeer
79. Castor et Pollux – Jean-Philippe Rameau **
80. La Cenerentola – Gioacchino Rossini **
81. Pique Dame – Peter Illitch Tchaikovsky **
82. Billy Budd – Benjamin Britten **
83. La Fille du Regiment – Gaetano Donizetti **
84. Le Prophete – Giacomo Meyerbeer
85. Le Coq D'or – Nikolai Rimsky-Korsakoff
86. McBeth – Giuseppe Verdi **
87. Les Pecheurs des Perles – Georges Bizet **
88. The Pilgrim's Progress – Ralph Vaughan Williams
89. Ernani – Giuseppe Verdi
90. Gianni Schicchi – Giacomo Puccini **
91. Beatrice et Benedict – Hector Berlioz
92. Simon Boccanegra – Giuseppe Verdi
93. Prince Igor – Alexander Borodin **
94. Nabucco – Giuseppe Verdi **
95. The Abduction from the Seraglio – Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart **
96. Euryanthe – Carl Maria von Weber
97. Dialogues des Carmelites – Frances Poulenc
98. Atys – Jean-Baptiste Lully **
99. Thais – Jules Massenet
100. Martha – Friederich von Flotow


Greatest Composers of Operas
1. Richard Wagner
2. Giuseppe Verdi
3. Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart
4. Giacomo Puccini
5. Richard Strauss
6. Gioacchino Rossini
7. Gaetano Donizetti
8. Vincenzo Bellini **
9. Benjamin Britten
10. Charles Gounod
11. Georges Bizet
12. Jules Massenet
13. Giacomo Meyerbeer **
14. Claudio Monteverdi
15. Peter Ilyich Tchaikovsky


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 Post subject: Re: Greatest Operas
PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2010 4:20 pm 
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Revision:
Greatest Operas
1. Der Ring des Nibelungen – Richard Wagner
2. Tristan Und Isolde – Richard Wagner
3. Don Giovanni – Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart
4. Otello – Giuseppe Verdi
5. The Marriage of Figaro – Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart
6. Aida – Giuseppe Verdi
7. La Boheme – Giacomo Puccini
8. Madame Butterfly – Giacomo Puccini
9. Der Rosenkavalier – Richard Strauss
10. Parsifal – Richard Wagner
11. Boris Godunov – Modest Mussorgsky
12. La Traviata – Giuseppe Verdi
13. Carmen – Georges Bizet
14. Die Meistersinger – Richard Wagner
15. The Magic Flute – Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart
16. Tosca – Giacomo Puccini
17. Falstaff – Giuseppe Verdi
18. Rigoletto – Giuseppe Verdi
19. The Barber Of Seville – Gioacchino Rossini
20. Il Trovatore – Giuseppe Verdi
21. Cavalleria Rusticana – Pietro Mascagni
22. Turandot – Giacomo Puccini
23. Faust – Charles Gounod
24. Lohengrin – Richard Wagner
25. Peter Grimes – Benjamin Britten
26. Norma – Vincenzo Bellini
27. Tannhauser – Richard Wagner
28. I Pagliacci – Rugierro Leoncavallo
29. Pelleas and Mellisande – Claude Debussy
30. Lucia Di Lammermoor – Gaetano Donizetti
31. Les Troyens – Hector Berlioz
32. Elektra – Richard Strauss
33. Cosi Fan Tutte – Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart
34. Porgy & Bess – George Gershwin
35. Fidelio – Ludwig Van Beethoven
36. Eugene Onegin – Peter Illitch Tchaikovsky
37. Wozzeck – Alban Berg
38. Incoronazione di Poppea – Claudio Monteverdi
39. Dido and Aneas – Henry Purcell
40. Orpheus and Eurydice – Christoph Willibald Gluck
41. Salome – Richard Strauss
42. Der Freischutz – Carl Maria von Weber
43. Don Carlos – Giuseppe Verdi
44. Orfeo – Claudio Monteverdi
45. The Cunning Little Vixen – Leos Janacek
46. Tales of Hoffman – Jacques Offenbach
47. Samson and Delilah – Camille Saint-Saens
48. The Flying Dutchman – Richard Wagner
49. Hansel and Gretel – Engelbert Humperdink
50. La Gioconda – Amiliare Ponchielli
51. The Rake's Progress – Igor Stravinsky
52. Manon – Jules Massenet
53. The Bartered Bride – Bedrich Smetana
54. The Huguenots – Giacomo Meyerbeer
55. La Forza Del Destino – Giuseppe Verdi
56. Manon Lescaut – Giacomo Puccini
57. Ariadne auf Naxos – Richard Strauss
58. Romeo and Juliet – Charles Gounod
59. L'Elisir D'Amore – Gaetano Donizetti
60. Lakme – Leo Delibes
61. Andre Chenier – Umberto Giordano
62. Werther – Jules Massenet
63. Don Pasquale – Gaetano Donizetti
64. Jenufa – Leos Janacek
65. Julius Caesar – Georg Friedrich Handel
66. Turn of the Screw – Benjamin Britten
67. La Sonnambula – Vincenzo Bellini
68. Duke Bluebeard’s Castle – Bela Bartok
69. Iphigénie en Tauride – Christoph Willibald Gluck **
70. Louise – Gustave Charpentier
71. La Cenerentola – Gioacchino Rossini
72. Billy Budd – Benjamin Britten
73. La Serva Padrona – Giovanni Pergolesi
74. Semiramide – Gioacchino Rossini
75. Doktor Faust – Ferruccio Busoni **
76. The Threepenny Opera – Kurt Weill **
77. Pique Dame – Peter Illitch Tchaikovsky
78. A Midsummer Night’s Dream – Benjamin Britten **
79. Khovanshina – Modest Mussorgsky **
80. Alceste – Christoph Willibald Gluck **
81. I Puritani – Vincenzo Bellini
82. Castor et Pollux – Jean-Philippe Rameau
83. The Masked Ball – Giuseppe Verdi
84. Moses und Aron – Arnold Schoenberg **
85. McBeth – Giuseppe Verdi
86. William Tell – Gioacchino Rossini
87. Les Pecheurs des Perles – Georges Bizet
88. Mefistofele – Arrigo Boito
89. L'Africaine – Giacomo Meyerbeer
90. La Fille du Regiment – Gaetano Donizetti
91. Le Prophete – Giacomo Meyerbeer
92. Le Coq D'or – Nikolai Rimsky-Korsakoff
93. The Girl of the Golden West – Giacomo Puccini
94. Die Tote Stadt – Erich Wolfgang Korngold
95. Ernani – Giuseppe Verdi
96. The Abduction from the Seraglio – Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart
97. Dialogues des Carmelites – Frances Poulenc
98. Einstein on the Beach – Philip Glass **
99. Idomeneo – Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart **
100. Kat’a Kabanova – Leos Janacek **
101. Il Matrimonio Segreto – Domenico Cimarosa **
102. Amahl and the Night Visitors – Gian Carlo Menotti **
103. Gianni Schicchi – Giacomo Puccini
104. Alcina – Georg Friedrich Handel **
105. Palestrina – Hans Pfitzner **
106. Fra Diavolo – Daniel-Francois Auber **
107. L’Enfant et les Sortiges – Maurice Ravel **
108. Die Frau ohne Schatten – Richard Strauss **
109. Lady Macbeth of Mtsensk District – Dmitri Shostakovich **
110. Die Lustigen Weiber von Windsor – Otto Nicolai **
111. Simon Boccanegra – Giuseppe Verdi
112. Prince Igor – Alexander Borodin
113. War and Peace – Sergei Prokofiev **
114. Beatrice et Benedict – Hector Berlioz
115. Nabucco – Giuseppe Verdi
116. Atys – Jean-Baptiste Lully
117. Four Saints in Three Acts – Virgil Thomson **
118. Medee – Luigi Cherubini **
119. Martha – Friedrich von Flotow
120. Adriana Lecouvreur – Francesco Cilea **

Greatest Composers of Operas
1. Richard Wagner
2. Giuseppe Verdi
3. Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart
4. Giacomo Puccini
5. Richard Strauss
6. Gioacchino Rossini
7. Gaetano Donizetti
8. Benjamin Britten
9. Vincenzo Bellini
10. Georges Bizet
11. Charles Gounod
12. Claudio Monteverdi
13. Christoph Willibald Gluck **
14. Leos Janacek **
15. Modest Mussorgsky **

** indicates new entry.


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 Post subject: Re: Greatest Operas
PostPosted: Mon Oct 18, 2010 11:14 pm 
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I think Der Freischutz should be a lot higher. Awesome piece, plus it's extremely important in the history of the medium.

EINS!!!

It's a good Halloween piece


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 Post subject: Re: Greatest Operas
PostPosted: Sun Nov 21, 2010 9:02 am 
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Do you have an archive with the original discussion that resulted in this list?


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 Post subject: Re: Greatest Operas
PostPosted: Sun Nov 21, 2010 1:55 pm 
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The list resulted partly from discussion and partly from research. The discussion is in the opera thread of the old forum. The address is: http://digitaldreamdoor.com/forum1/index.php.


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 Post subject: Re: Greatest Operas
PostPosted: Sat Jan 08, 2011 2:02 pm 
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Location: "He that is good for making excuses is seldom good for anything else."
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3aS6M8j3pvQ
Juan Diego Florez - La Fille du Regiment - Ah mes amis
Florez is one of the best and there are 9 top Cs in this aria

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2XeDQ7S4dM
this is Enrico Caruso - La Bohème: Che Gelida Manina (1906)
also a great example of a tenor piece. the best note is about 3:20

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Funp7JTWp2A
Pavarotti - Una Furtiva Lagrima -L'Elisir d'Amore, Donizetti
it goes without saying, but his control is intense

Quote:
italian wikipedia : passaggio : in the lower passaggio is called chest voice or chest register with any singer produces a powerful sound and serious in its upper part is called head voice or head register. One of the key objectives in the formation of classical singing is to keep the timbre of the voice throughout the tessitura of the singer: with rare exceptions, only a voice sufficiently trained through specific vocal training, is able to overcome the passaggio smoothly and reach to deliver powerful sound well resonant at the upper vocal register. To achieve this, the chest register voice must be prepared to enter the record surpassing the record head falsetto coverage required by the note and the highest sound directivity to back, which is defined as the return of sound.


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 Post subject: Re: Greatest Operas
PostPosted: Sat Jan 08, 2011 3:55 pm 
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i think opera is more of a disease, or rather a symptom, than a musical genre


Quote:
Greatest Composers of Operas
14. Claudio Monteverdi
also this is insane... again i don't know what criteria was used for this, but almost any way i approach this, monteverdi has to be either #1 or at least #2


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 Post subject: Re: Greatest Operas
PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 1:19 am 
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Location: "He that is good for making excuses is seldom good for anything else."
Honestly, how can call opera a disease? It is the greatest and most dramatic human expression of language. Nothing comes close. It's like poetry x 1000.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0TnruLf_haY Fritz Wunderlich ... singing, as you might imagine, Mozart.

1-11 seem pretty solid to me. I suppose you could quibble about 12-15. The top 4 are indisputable. I don't believe I have ever heard any operas by Massenet or Meyerbeer and only one by Tchaikovsky - Onegin.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R6XB0HX9ILY renee fleming, lovely.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L'Orfeo << is this why you like Monteverdi? or is it Arianna?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kYUYbCksbjk Ebben from La Wally. Catalani is probably not famous famous, but this one aria certainly is. Favourite moment in La Wally is when the tenor is hurled down the ravine. Great note that.


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 Post subject: Re: Greatest Operas
PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 2:39 am 
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Krym wrote:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L'Orfeo << is this why you like Monteverdi? or is it Arianna?
well, i didn't say i like his stuff... i'm just applying my criteria for greatness which include originality and influence above all... and, to me, being the father of the genre means he scores extremely high in those categories, and thus should be able to challenge wagner for the #1 spot (and surely overtake everyone else between them).
i remember brian mentioned popularity was the main (maybe even the only??) criterion he uses, which is disappointing, but which would explain monteverdi's low placement.

Quote:
It is the greatest and most dramatic human expression of language.
mebbe. i won't argue that... but i do find most marriages of music and speech/poetry rather tacky... i find it sickening when music used for commercial almost without exception (because they're lying yet they want to sweeten the lies).... with opera, it's almost as bad, and i'm pretty sensitive to any sort of needless or overexaggerated melodrama, especially when sung with quivering annoying voices. but i won't trouble you with my misanthropic rants... (-:


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 Post subject: Re: Greatest Operas
PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 3:04 am 
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Location: "He that is good for making excuses is seldom good for anything else."
George wrote:
i'm pretty sensitive to any sort of needless or overexaggerated melodrama, especially when sung with quivering annoying voices. but i won't trouble you with my misanthropic rants... (-:
Needless? Where is your soul man? You're like one of my favourite music gurus on the planet, but g, at the end of carmen when the tormented, lovesick officer zuniga tells carmen he loves her - you WANT to be loved like that. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DfX4afH9wzw 3:08 Le Fleur song. And it certainly helps if hunky kaufmann is singing the part. A better Jonas to drool over.

And, also, it is just amazing how opera singers project. Live opera rokz.

Father of a genre goes to number #1 or #2....hmmm. No.


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 Post subject: Re: Greatest Operas
PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 3:12 pm 
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Higher than either Mozart or Wagner? No way. Puccini should be higher than Monteverdi also imo, but I do agree he's too low on the list. Let's move down Verdi, I don't like him anyway


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 Post subject: Re: Greatest Operas
PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 7:08 pm 
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The ranking of opera composers was based on the greatness of the operas, after the operas list was made. At the time, I made a list of where the composers' operas ranked on the list. I didn't make one for Wagner or Verdi, because they seemed to be the clear top 2, the only question being their order. FWIW, Verdi was #1 on the previous list. Here's where the operas for composers 3-15 rank:

Mozart 3, 5, 15, 34, 95
Puccini 7, 8, 16, 22, 56, 65, 90
Strauss 9, 33, 40, 57
Rossini 19, 69, 77, 80
Donizetti 31, 59, 63, 83, 96
Bellini 26, 66, 76
Britten 25, 67, 82
Gounod 23, 58
Bizet 13, 87
Massenet 52, 62, 99
Meyerbeer 54, 78, 84
Monteverdi 39, 45
Tchaikovsky 36, 81

Even by this method, Monteverdi could be higher. He could be ahead of Meyerbeer and Massenet, and possibly Bizet and Gounod.


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 Post subject: Re: Greatest Operas
PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 12:02 am 
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Location: "He that is good for making excuses is seldom good for anything else."
Not higher than Bizet and Gounod =] And I would swap Bizet with Bellini. What follows is a NYC-centric perspective...

My husband thought Strauss would rate higher if you were to quiz opera buffs. Puccini...just my own personal thought...his operas are more pretty than great. But very very very popular.

But have you considered looking at number of performances? For instance, New York’s Metropolitan Opera has performed Faust 723 (Oct 2006) times since 1880 something. 723 is a big number. So, I wouldn't move Gounod down =]

La Bohème 1218; Aida 1108; Carmen 969; La Traviata 961; Tosca 907; Rigoletto 831; Madama Butterfly 830; Cavalleria Rusticana 672 / Pagliacci 712; Il Trovatore 621; Il Barbiere di Siviglia 586; Don Giovanni 501; Tristan und Isolde 450; Figaro 442; Die Meistersinger 408; Die Zauberflöte 408; Der Rosenkavalier 370; Otello 292; Parsifal 288; Turandot 271; Boris Godunov 270; Falstaff 175;

A note about Cavalleria Rusticana / Pagliacci which are a dbl bill at the Met (and Sydney too)

These operas are “uno squarcio di vita” – a slice of life, exploring the raw passions of village communities in provincial Italy. They did not begin life as a double bill – that happened in 1893 at the Met and also in Australia. They were composed separately: Cavalleria first, given in 1890 and Pagliacci second, given in 1892 under Toscanini’s direction. But the fact that they had the same publishers, Sonzogno, probably had something to do with what has become undoubtedly one of the most popular and profitable couplings in opera.

http://archives.metoperafamily.org/archives/frame.htm

see 1912 review of Orfeo =]

http://opera.stanford.edu/misc/Dornic_survey.html old survey, but interesting


Last edited by Krym on Mon Jan 10, 2011 7:59 am, edited 3 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Greatest Operas
PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 12:09 am 
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I saw La Boheme at the Detroit Opera House the other month. It was my first Opera and I loved it.


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 Post subject: Re: Greatest Operas
PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 5:22 pm 
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Krym wrote:
But have you considered looking at number of performances? For instance, New York’s Metropolitan Opera has performed Faust 723 (Oct 2006) times since 1880 something. 723 is a big number. So, I wouldn't move Gounod down =]


I haven't looked at number of performances, though that probably is a factor considered by the sources that I did use. I wonder how much different a ranking by number of performances in New York is from that of, say, Vienna.

I don't necessarily disagree with you about Bizet and Gounod, but both have one very big opera, and a 2nd that I thought was big enough to include on the list, but didn't have has many significant operas as some composers.


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