If Bozzio is such a great fusion drummer do you think you could prove it to me by showing me a few sources? I have edited his profile by putting classical down, considering a lot of his newer stuff has been described as classical on many reliable websites. Considering the genres that musicians play is very subjective I have a hard time seeing Bozzio on the jazz and fusion lists. I really want someone to prove it to me, because as hard as I try I have not been able to find any fusion stuff done by Bozzio.

Zoot Allures - Frank Zappa
Heavy Metal Be-Bop - Brecker Brothers
Shut Up ‘N Play Yer Guitar - Frank Zappa
Jeff Beck’s Guitar Shop - Jeff Beck
[sic] - Alex Machacek

Etc.

Honestly, some of those sound like instrumental rock with some traces of fusion (except Brecker Brothers & Beck). I even looked to see if any websites went into any insight on how those albums were fusion. Just telling me they are fusion isn't good enough. Anybody can lay down an album and say it's fusion. In all honesty the Zappa albums don't even sound like fusion. As for the Brecker Brothers and Beck album, I think that they were playing fusion while wanting the rock drummer background by adding Bozzio. Just because someone plays with a fusion band doesn't mean that they themselves are playing fusion. It's kind of like how The Chick Corea Elektric Band is considered post-bop/fusion; yet I would not call Frank Gambale a post-bop guitarist just because he participates in their post-bop/fusion albums such as "Inside Out". He himself is always playing fusion, while the main artist (Corea) is laying down more of the post-bop grooves.

Well...that's your opinion...and you don't think Zappa is fusion, along with having this "three-part" definition of the genre I don't (and neither do most people I know who listen to/play this stuff). I know a lot of guys from Zappa's bands, and I think they'd likely get a good laugh out of that, especially considering the fact they had to learn all those incredibly difficult parts and then play them live without charts. Actually, probably a really good laugh. I'll see Terry (and Chad Wackerman and Ralph Humphrey and Vinnie Colaiuta) again before too long...I'm pretty sure all of them will find it funny as well.

Well, actually it is not my opinion that the Zappa albums you presented to me are pretty much straight ahead progressive rock. It is a fact since I have researched and have not been able to find any data describing how the Zappa albums you presented are fusion; contrary I find all the websites stating how they are instrumental/progressive rock. I know Zappa has composed fusion. I'm not real big on him yet it seems that He is more of a rock artist who has drawn from many different genres of music, hence that is why much of it is considered progressive rock considering progressive rock draws from many genres.

Personally, I think Hot Rats to be the album that demonstrates Zappa's fusion.

"Fact" because you "researched" it? Ayyiyiyi. I'll take "Grand Wazoo" and "Shut Up", tyvm.

Well, I'm pretty sure the best way to solve discrepancies is to get good sources that state what the genre of music is. Even according to ProgArchives, "Zoot Allures" is about as stripped down and bare bones as you'll see with a Frank Zappa record. Gone are the jazz elements were so used to,and in place of that are more straight forward Rock songs". No offense, but your word is not gospel. I try to look for reliable sources rather than just word of mouth, and so far the sources are showing me that the Zappa albums you presented are not fusion. Considering you write for fusion settings, if you could do me a big favor and write up some stuff on a webpage describing a particular group and how their certain elements make them fusion or whatever. I would appreciate it.

As stated numerous times...this stuff is opinion, in the end. Prog Archives is a wonderful resource, but it's no more gospel than here. I'm not sure if I interviewed five guys who played Zappa's music, for him, who all said yes, and then presented it to you, that you'd agree, as whatever source(s) you think are valid don't consider Zappa as "fusion". As I've also said numerous times, I know more of these guys personally than almost anyone, and I tend to go to those musicians first for opinions, as opposed to other sources. They know best. By miles.

Let me add this...since you seem to be interested in Wikipedia. Wikipedia doesn't like first-hand research, which is something I disagree with them about, and one of the reasons I rarely write there anymore after authoring more than 100 articles, including dozens on fusion artists. I have the ability to talk to almost any musician I wish to if needed, my sources are first-hand, and as good and often better than nearly anything Wikipedia has on said artists/music. The top-level musicians that play this music generally know and respect what I do and are willing to talk to me when I need to. Wikipedia is a very helpful resource, but its lack of expert and particularly first-hand knowledge is a fundamental limitation on subjects where there's not a lot of published information. I'm not going to knock myself out trying to publish to a source Wikipedia's editors, who are often college-age with little first-hand knowledge on the subject(s) in question, think is "valid" in order to meet their guidelines...I have way better things to do with my time. The stupid thing is that if I wanted to, I could self-publish a book I could then cite at will as a "legitimate" source, but I can't do the research and use Wikipedia for said publishing. Wikipedia editors can go way, way too far in wanting every single line in an article sourced, even if you list the sources as references in an article's summary. I am not going to footnote every single line just to "prove" something to someone who fancies themselves an editor.

I got into this stuff personally with Wikipedia founder Jimmy Wales and some of his admins years ago, and rapidly understood how Wikipedia really functions. The last thing I'm going to do is try and argue with a 20-something who has zero first-hand knowledge of a subject I lived through, or about someone I know directly, who thinks they somehow have more expertise based on what they've read decades later...they don't.

The scenario I compare it to is putting a recent college graduate with no real-life experience in charge of a newsroom full of people with hundreds of years of collective experience, all because that recent graduate had done a lot of "research" on how a newsroom is supposed to operate while in college. That model is one no real business would ever implement, but Jimmy Wales likes, in part, because of how he's able to maintain control of Wikipedia by doing so. It's also why Wikipedia competitors have been established that have editors that are genuine experts.

It's also why I choose to mainly write articles about upcoming gigs, rather than offer my "considered opinion" after the fact when a gig is over, just so I can pontificate about who was or wasn't "good" in my opinion on any given night. A lot of people who write music reviews are are more interested in pounding their own chest saying "look how smart I am" than anything else. My main interest is "putting butts in seats" so the music continues to get heard live. I have a private mailing list of hundreds of people, mostly musicians, who like that mailer because they respect who I say is going to be worth hearing around SoCal during any given week. I've been humbled to have some of the world's best players whip out their smartphones and pull up my mailer when someone else walks into a conversation and asks about upcoming shows. To me...there is little higher praise.

Hey fusion07, do you think you could show me a few of the articles that you have written? I'd like to read them.

I write a weekly column at LAJazz.com called "About & Out"...feel free to check there.

Do you think you could provide me with a link? Thanks. Oh wait I think I found it. So you're Tom Meek? http://www.lajazz.com/blog18.cfm

That's cool that you're all about virtuosity. I'm also quiet a virtuoso fanatic myself.

Considering you know a lot about fusion, I have a question that I have been really wanting an answer to. I know fusion does not utilize vocals very often, yet sometimes it does contain vocals every now and then. I would like to know if there is such a thing as "fusion singing". Over the years there have been vocalists who have participated in fusion bands such as Pauline Wilson, Flora Purim, Sandhya Sanjana etc... Now, are these singers actually singing fusion, or are they simply just singing jazz within an instrumental fusion structure? I've looked everywhere on the internet for "fusion singing" or "fusion singers", yet I am always disappointed in not being able to find any anything related to "jazz-rock fusion singing".

I guess the closest thing to fusion singing would be this?: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NDBaqbj6nD4

Again, it depends on your definition of fusion. Most of the music is instrumental, yes. In the early days you had groups like Blood, Sweat & Tears and Chicago that were more traditionally song/vocal based. There are some excellent vocals from Leon Thomas and Wendy Haas with Santana, and Haas and others with Azteca. The first Brecker brothers band, Dreams, had vocals. Scott Henderson has vocals in his blues/fusion recordings from people like Thelma Houston. There's a tune with vocals on Allan Holdsworth's "Secrets" record. You mentioned Flora Purim with RTF. There are some others out there as well, but the substantial majority of the music is instrumental.

My question is if the vocals in these "fusion" albums are inherently fusion themselves? In other words, is there such thing as a fusion singer? Or, are all vocals in fusion going to be either jazz vocals (RTF albums), pop vocals (Frank Gambale's albums) , R&B vocals (Lenny White albums), or rock vocals (Allan Holdsworth albums)? Thanks, I hope you understand what I mean.

I understand your question...as I said...it depends on your definition of fusion. If you take it in the "strictest" sense of the term, I'm not presently aware of a singer that could be referred to primarily as a "fusion singer".